I Think I Finally Get It

If you're an atheist, you probably hear this a lot: You hate God. It's not that you don't believe in God, it's that you totally hate him. Probably because your relationship with your father was bad. But you totally believe in him.

This argument is, of course, wildly frustrating. You're inside your own brain. You know what you think and believe and for someone else to tell you different is, at best, rude. Plus, how do you argue with someone who thinks they know you better than you know you? There's really nowhere to go with that.

I love music. I have always loved music. When I was five, my favorite record* was by the Tijuana Brass. I would play it endlessly and dance to it. (I was never into kids' music at all.) I played clarinet for six years. The last two years, I was playing several hours a day (up to six on weekends) and earned a scholarship to study music. Nerve damage to my right hand ended that dream, but music is still as important to me as food.

That's not true. I have chosen to spend money on music instead of food. Music is more important to me than food.

Anyway, last week, my brother-in-law (hereinafter "BIL") was at the house at the height of my husband's mixing marathon (he sent the album for mastering Wednesday). We don't have soundproofing, so you can hear the music fairly clearly on the first floor. My BIL asked me if that drove me crazy, because it would drive him crazy to hear that all the time.

I was flabbergasted.

The Awkward Out (album name) has been the background to everything I have done in the last year: cleaning, bathing, gaming, watching TV, if my husband was awake and not in the room with me, that's what I was listening to. And I love it. I've been bereft since the album went for mastering and my husband, burnt out after two weeks of 16 hour days, hasn't been writing/recording.

It turns out that my BIL doesn't like music. He doesn't like any music at all. Music is as irrelevant to him as God is to me.

That seriously freaks me out. I don't understand it. At first, I thought my BIL just doesn't like Skull Has a Secret's (band name) style of music. I don't judge anyone's taste in music. I like some weird stuff myself, so I'm not judgey about anyone else's taste.

No, he just doesn't like music. I find this very hard to comprehend. So I think I get where believers are coming from in refusing to believe I don't believe in God.

However, no matter how bizarre a statement I may find "I don't like music" to be, I trust that my BIL knows how he feels on this subject. I don't argue with him when he says he likes to watch Nascar. That's five hours of left turn, but if he says he likes it, he does. And if he says he doesn't like music, he doesn't.

And when I say I don't believe in God, I don't. Trust me on this one.



*Yes, I am totally that old.

Voices of Me!

Being an atheist named Faith is mostly ridiculous and occasionally hilarious*. Today it's the latter. (thank you to [redacted] for the link.)

Voices of Faith: How do I know what is the true religion?

Voice of Faith: there is no god, therefore, no religion is true. Go, and wonder no more.

The Rev. Duke Tufty, Unity Temple on the Plaza, Kansas City, Mo.: There are two basic ways to know what the true religion is. The first is to let another or others tell you. In most cases their response will be "my" religion is the only true religion.

Voice of Faith: "Most cases"? If you didn't think your religion was the one true religion, why would you believe in it? Well, I guess those friendly universalists who are pretty open about their need to believe in something even if they have no idea whether or not it is real. Unsurprisingly, universalists are pleasant to be an atheist around.

The second way for you to know what is the true religion is to personalize it and do research to discover what the true religion is for you. Read the statement of beliefs, acquaint yourself with the history and determine whether the theology inspires you, empowers you and resonates with your deepest beliefs.

Your spiritual path should be one that impassions you, not imprisons you. It should be one that continually moves you to higher levels of joy, love, peace of mind and harmony. Seek and you will find the spiritual source that is best for you. The one that truly supports your greatest happiness and highest good.

Look, I'm down with the universalism, but "it makes me happy" does not make something true. Unfortunately, "it's the highest good" doesn't make something true, either.

The Rev. Justin Hoye, pastor of St. Mary's Catholic Church, Nevada, Mo., and St. Bridget's in Rich Hill, Mo: You don't - that's why faith is called for! I can give personal testimonies and historical accounts that could tip the scale toward belief in the person of Jesus Christ. But you can dismiss these professions as biased, unsubstantiated or unreliable. That is, at a certain point you are asked to assent to these claims with an act of faith.

Yeah, look, you could look at the evidence and conclude this is all a bunch of bullshit, but . . . faith!

Faith: "yes?"

Priest "Oh, I didn't mean you."

Faith "Hey, you called for me, I answered. What up?"

Priest "Well, look, I . . ."

Faith "Seriously, are you selling that 'faith is truth if only you believe' bullshit again? That shit's not true."

Priest "Historica-"

Faith "If I believe that I am a invisible pink unicorn does that make it true?"

Priest "That is not a fair comparis-"

Faith "Fine. I have faith, complete faith, that the events as related in Girl Genius are the absolute truth. I even have evidence- look at all these books, and this website and all these people dressed up like the characters! It must be true."

Priest "I really hate you."

Faith "Right back at you, buddy."

A Catholic professes that Jesus Christ is the savior of all and that knowledge of this truth is universally accessible; i.e., this truth is accessible to you and to everyone else.

We say this is possible because faith is in communion with reason, and the church works tirelessly to present her beliefs so that they not only provide direction and, ultimately, salvation, but express a faith that is in concord with reason.

For what definition of reason? I can't . . . I just . . . there is no part of that that is "in concord with reason". I mean, what part of God sacrificed God to God to change a rule God made is "in concord with reason"?

Christian faith is mysterious, yet it resonates with our experience of the human condition. A Catholic would invite you to investigate the claims of the church to see if they speak to your heart and mind.

Evidence is there, along with the reality that men and women throughout the centuries have been so captivated by an encounter with Jesus that they profess him to be true. They - we - have found the truth that sets us free. Our access to this reality comes when we cease looking for undeniable proof and make an act of faith.

People have also, for centuries, professed to be true: faeries, unicorns, Zeus, Thor, Odin, ghosts, demons, elementals, magic, telekinesis, telepathy, astrology, homeopathy, I could go on all day. Are all of those things also real? How many people have to believe a thing for how long to become real under your system? Is there some sort of cutoff? More people than accept the Book of Mormon as true, for longer than Islam has been around? C'mon now.

*Sometimes, I get to type bad faith complaints and I giggle the entire time.

That's Your Final Answer? You Really Don't Want to Change It? You Sure?

An animation of the interaction inside a neutron. Mostly unrelated, but cool.

ETA: The link to the article I was fisking. Oops!

I would like to begin this by pointing out that "New Atheist" is a code phrase, not an honest descriptive. There is no such thing as "new" atheism. Atheism is the lack of a god belief, nothing more. There hasn't been anything new in atheism since ever. Anything other than a lack of god belief is not atheism.

"New Atheism"/"New Atheist" refers to atheists speaking their minds, writing books and blog posts, wearing T-shirts and putting stickers on their cars and generally being exactly as open and vocal as Christians are in the US. So, of course, we're "rude", "shrill", "angry", "bitter" awful people who need to shut the fuck up and leave the talking to the Christians. Cuz, you know, privilege.

Anyway, here's a fun post:

This is why I don't--why I can't--agree with the so-called New Atheists. Yes, some people's religions lead them to believe demonstrably false statements, such as that the Earth is 6,000 years old, you can cure cancer with acupuncture, or prayer can change the path of a hurricane. These people are wrong and should be argued with, as well as pitied. And yes, some people use their religions to justify causing great harm and suffering. These people are assholes and should be opposed.

But most religious people, which is to say most people, don't. Nothing in their religion leads them to believe anything demonstrably false, or that ever could be demonstrably false. There is thus no meaningful sense in which atheism is more or less objective, or more or less correct, than any of a host of religious worldviews, and most of the arguments otherwise are strawmen. True, atheism is more parsimonious, but parsimony is a standard of the scientific method; there is no particular reason to insist on it in other endeavors.

That raises a whole host of questions. Are you capable of agreeing with old atheists, you know, the quiet, in-the-shadows, hope-nobody-finds-out atheists? Are they just a little easier to take? Yeah, fun.

I. All religious beliefs cannot be true, therefore most, if not all but one, must be false, therefore the following statement is false.

But this, Nothing in their religion leads them to believe anything demonstrably false, or that ever could be demonstrably false, is a thing of beauty. Not one thing. Not one thing in their religion leads them to believe anything demonstrably false.

That actually cannot be true. See, the author never specifies a certain religion, though I suppose he meant Christianity. But he does not specify. Therefore, he says that this is true for Christians and Shintoists and animists and Muslims and pagans and Jews and Hindus and Zoroastrians and everybody else.

Suppose the atheists - whether new, old, medium, well done, beer battered and fried- are wrong. Suppose there is a divine force that created the universe, a divine force we refer to as god(s). So simply believing in god would not be demonstrably wrong. But religion goes a little further than simply "Hey, there's a god!" If I am a Muslim, I believe entirely different things about the nature of God(s) and what he/they expect(s) from me than a Hindu does. My religion requires that I believe these things. If I don't believe these things, I am not Muslim or Hindu.

In other words, even if there is/are (a) god(s)*, most people are believing something demonstrably false. They have to be.

II. This is a blameshift, not an honest argument

But, let's disallow the existence of unproven god(s). I am, after all, an atheist, so I don't believe in any of that. Let's reexamine the statement that Nothing in their religion leads them to believe anything demonstrably false, or that ever could be demonstrably false. First of all, the previous statement is Yes, some people's religions lead them to believe demonstrably false statements, such as that the Earth is 6,000 years old, you can cure cancer with acupuncture, or prayer can change the path of a hurricane.

So, really, I think this is more about pushing Christians the author considers embarrassing away from hir own faith than anything else. There's no real need to bring up atheists new, near, far, where ever you are, into this at all, unless you're going for what all siblings recognize as the double blameshift: It wasn't me and zie's worse! Those other Christians believe ridiculous things that have nothing to do with Christianity (though they'll totally say it does), and anyway, atheists are ridiculous, too. I'm totally reasonable.

I get it. Nobody wants to be associated with some asshole saying that Japan totally deserved what they got because they don't worship the right god the right way. But you know what the difference is between me and the author? I don't deny that guy is a US citizen just like I am. I'm not happy about it, but I don't verbally decitizenize him to make myself feel better.

I also get that believers must feel a bit put upon when they read (up down charm strange top bottom) atheists' writings asking for proof and stuff. "Hey, can you prove you love your wife? Then don't ask me to prove god and the afterlife and miracles." Yeah, that's asinine. Stop asserting stuff you can't prove. And if being asked to do so makes you feel all sad inside, well, I don't know what to tell you. I wouldn't believe you flapped your arms and flew to work without proof, either, so don't feel too bad.

III. Adding demonstrably does not make your beliefs any more true, nor do they now require less proof.

Perhaps, though, I am missing the point. Perhaps the proof is in the adverb pudding**. Nothing in their religion leads them to believe anything demonstrably false, or that ever could be demonstrably false.

Demonstrably. Hmmm . . . I'd have to demonstrate the beliefs are false. Haha! Tricky! But not. Suppose I tell you that I have the cure to cancer in this coffee cup. I would imagine you'd want me to demonstrate that the substance in my cup actually cures cancer, wouldn't you? Would you be convinced if I told you that I'm not going to do that, but you can't prove that it doesn't? I would hope not. I would hope that you would go about your day, secure in the knowledge that I do not have the cure to cancer in a coffee cup.

That's what the less strident god belief is, really. I can't prove there isn't a god, so there is one. Take that atheists! You can't demonstrate I'm wrong, so I must be right! I'm in ur logic syllogizing ur statements!

Right now, I'm an eye-rolling atheist, but hardly new.

*I have been typing so many legal documents. So many. All the parens look normal to me at this point.

**Fucking delicious!

30 Days of Belief

I've seen this suggestion before for "curing" atheism:

Truly try to believe in Christianity for a month. Just 30 days. Give it a shot, because it can't hurt anything.

I don't know that I've ever met anyone for whom atheism was a choice, who just decided one day that the whole belief thing is a drag, so fuck it, I don't believe anymore. Most atheists I know were believers at one point, including myself. I was horrified when I realized I didn't believe anymore. I panicked, in fact, desperately trying to believe in something, anything. I felt lost and abandoned and betrayed. For the very first time, I felt my mortality, a real heaven-free mortality, and I did not like it.

I tried so hard to believe. I just couldn't.

It doesn't work. If you don't believe me, try believing, sincerely, for a mere 30 days, in invisible pink unicorns. You can't, no matter how hard you try. You know damn well invisible pink unicorns do not exist, and once you know that, there's no going back. Not for 30 days, not for ever.

Trust me, I tried.

pic link

Why Do People Believe In God (in Their Words)

Oh, my. I am so embarrassed for some people.

I believed in God because I was raised to. My parents took me to church for the first time 12 days after I was born. (Christmas mass.) Once I started actually thinking about it for myself, a process that began in the first grade, I eventually came to the conclusion that I did not, in fact, believe in any god of any kind.

So, I am always very interested in why others believe, although generally it's because they were raised to believe, as well. (I'm talking about base belief, not switching from one religion to another, or switching from one sect to another within the same religion.)

Honestly, these reasons for believing are mind boggling in their lol wut?ness.

Tonight at my Bible study I asked this question to everyone, why do you believe in God? I thought I would ask the same question on RR.

Someone said " Do you believe in you wife? You do because you got to know her, it's the same with Jesus"

I assume by "wife" you mean "actual living person you can actually meet", not "invisible friend", right? You do see a difference between the two, right, because if not, I'm just going to assume there is no wife.

Life and the incredible design and genetic programming within living things is way too complex. There had to be an incredible being who designed and created what we see even though it is a world marred by sin. For atheists to think that random processes, time and chance could create anything is just fairy tale thinking and of course it is passed off as science.

Of course if you can think straight thus far, the next step would be to meet that creator in His revelation, found in the KJV for English speaking people.

Thank you.
Sherlock Holmes

Um, wut? The first paragraph is an appeal to irreducible complexity, not actually proof, but what is the second and why did Mr. Holmes show up?

Because the evidence of his existence is simply too compelling to leave any other answer but a resounding "YES!" Creation has his marks and "signature" all over it, his word, the Bible has been proven time and again as accurate and true...


Not to mention no one can explain the re-emergence of Israel in their own land with their own culture and language after 1400 years, unless He exists.

Irreducible complexity and . . . the Jews? Because no one has ever maintained a culture for that long before, you know, other than the Chinese, or Indians or aborigines on various continents, you know, other than that.

I have been made into a completely new person gradualy over the last 7 years since I acepted Christ. I feel Him so strongly it just feels like I am wrapped in His heart. I cant describe it. So I know Jesus is real. Also when I read His Word I feel so very connected like His Word is alive. I was created for Him and I rest safely now thanks to Him!

So, you didn't believe in God until 7 years after you believed in God? Even allowing for that stunning abuse of logic, I've changed in the last 7 years, too. Has anyone not?

Because He says so in His Word....and it is by faith.

I believe in God because the Bible says so. I believe in the Bible because God says so and round and round in circles we go, we die not of death, we die of vertigo.

Because He lives inside of me and that's how I know He's real.

You know, like tapeworms.

This is the same with me. Since I was very little, as far back as I could remember I always believed there was a God. I don't know how I knew it, I just did. My Grandmother was saved and she would talk to me about God and I guess I just believed everything she said, but I don't remember ever not believing in Him. Hmmm......

Wow, it's almost like I've never really thought about it, hmmmm . . . .

Because I can feel Him. Because His prophesies have come true. Because nature is systemized. Because He rose from the dead and had a lot of witnesses. Because believing in Him is just plain common sense. You just know. Because prayer has changed me. It's one of those things. You just know. I have questioned it because I used to over analyze. One can analyze their own self out of existence. The wake up call for me was literally seeing the flip side of Him. That is those of the under world and I don't believe I'm crazy in that respect. Seeing is believing. And oh ya, you just know.

I just know. And I've seen demons. Ya know.

I completely echo what onceblind said. I believe in anyone I have had a conversation with. Not just a monologue. If God didn't answer back, it would be difficult for me to believe. But, we have had a dialogue. I have spoken to Him and He has spoken back. That's why I believe. I heard His voice stronger than ever on April 14, 2005. I had prayed about two young ladies I was attracted to. I asked God which one He wanted me to have a relationship with--to ultimately be with until death. I asked Him that on April 10. Four days later I received an answer. God had spoken Heather's name to me, and that was it. Two years later, we got married. That's just one example out of many. That's why I believe.

Auditory hallucinations: changing lives since April 14, 2005.

Same for me pretty much, I was raised with a Christian background so there was never really a time in my life when I did not believe in God in some way, but understanding the complexity of our world and how accurately the Bible describes science related matters that were not discovered by the modern sience until recently really made my faith strong. Biblical prophecy as well, one has to have an extremely hardened heart not to acknowledge how amazing it is and that it had to come from outside of our space and time.

Scientific marvels like four legged bugs and bats being birds. Astounding! Not to mention all the biblical prophecy that has not come true and never will.

So . . . people believe just because, because they're parents did, because of circular logic, a lack of understanding of science and because they haven't actually read the Bible. Interesting.

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In Which I Am Dismissive of IQ

I'll start this out by saying that I have an IQ that falls, depending upon which of eight different results you want to look at, somewhere between really high and astronomically high. Considering that I'm a secretary, I fail to see how useful a high IQ really is. Opportunity is a useful thing, access is a useful thing, but an IQ above average isn't really all that useful.

I'm also suspicious of IQ measurements as a whole. There isn't a great deal of consensus as to what exactly is being measured, for one thing. There is a certain cultural bias to IQ tests. Also, while there is a tremendous amount of difference between the capabilities of people at the extreme high and low ends of the scale, there isn't much appreciable difference between the capabilities of people at the average and high ends of the scale. I'm not really sure why we bother to measure IQ at all, other than the fact that people really like numbers a lot.

For example, take a look at the above graph, describing IQ by religion. I suppose I could crow about atheists falling at the upper end of the graph, but look at the range described: 113.43 to 101.89. Don't feel bad Pentecostals, that's not much of a difference. In fact, given that my own IQ varies as much as 25 points depending upon which test result you look at, a range of 11.54 doesn't mean a thing. Basically, IQ doesn't vary according to religion.

Anyway, that's my thoughts on the matter. I don't know what the difference is between believers and nonbelievers. I don't think it's intelligence. I've known some very foolish atheists and some very intelligent people who believe very foolish things. Whatever it is, smarts aren't in it.

Daddy Issues

I have come to the conclusion that if you have, or have had, a father, you have daddy issues, and if you have, or have had, a mother, you have mommy issues.

I have come to this conclusion because I haven't talked to anyone- atheist, believer, don't care- that doesn't have parental issues. Why is that? Because parents are people like you and me, and despite their heroic status in the minds of little children, they screw up. Parents lie, break promises, lose their tempers, speak thoughtlessly- because that's what people do.

My point is that it is ridiculous to say that parental issues cause atheism, though you see it all the time.

In the book, Spiegel notes that many well-known atheists share the
experiences of having lost fathers when they were young, or have fathers that
were alcoholics, abusive or "defective" in some other way.

Among celebrity atheists, both Jodie Foster and George Carlin lost their
fathers when they were young. Spiegel also cites research by New York University
Psychology Professor Paul C. Vitz who found a significant link between
fatherlessness and atheism. In his book, "Faith of the Fatherless," Vitz lists
influential atheists who as children experienced the death of their fathers:
Friedrich Nietzsche, Bertrand Russell and Jean-Paul Sartre. He also names
atheists such as Thomas Hobbes who had weak or abusive fathers. Spiegel notes
that Professor Daniel Dennett's father died in a plane crash when the boy was 5
and Christopher Hitchen's father was distant and his mother killed herself in a
suicide pact with a lover when Hitchens was 24 years old.

So, we have a dozen people who had weak (I don't even know what that means), abusive or absent fathers and who were also atheists. Ergo . . . nothing. I've read dozens of testimonies from believers who had abusive or absent fathers. How can the same thing cause both atheism and theism? It boggles the mind.

What proof of this is there? Why, the Bible, of course!

"This doesn't prove that every atheist necessarily is the product of bad
father relationships, or that's a necessary condition for atheism, but it's very
suggestive and I'd see it as one significant, causal influence," Spiegel says.
"

From the standpoint of scripture … the basic idea is that God – as our
heavenly father – is mirrored by our earthly father. And so when that
relationship is broken, it has a kind of psychological influence on our approach
to God."Exploring the "biblical diagnosis" of atheism, Spiegel argued it
involves a "hardening of the heart" (Ephesians 4:18) and the suppression of the
truth by wickedness (Romans 1:18). And although a broken relationship with one's
father is often involved in this process it's often combined with a form of
rebellion - resentment, hatred, vanity, unforgiveness or pride.

I love the way Spiegel weaves together psychology, a scientific field that uses scientific principals, and Bible quotes. He doesn't offer any proof of his assertions whatsoever besides Bible quotes and negative words- resentment, hatred, vanity, unforgiveness or pride. (Theists, naturally, must be grateful, loving, humble, forgiving and, um, humble.)

"The hardening of the atheistic mind-set occurs through cognitive malfunction
due to two principal causes," Spiegel wrote. "First, atheists suffer from
paradigm-induced blindness, as their worldview inhibits their ability to
recognize the reality of God that is manifest in creation. Second, atheists
suffer from damage to the sensus divinitatis, so their natural awareness of God
is severely impeded. Both of these mechanisms are aspects of the noetic effects
of sin. This combination of factors amounts to a deadly cognitive cocktail when
it comes to religious belief. However, thankfully, even the atheist is not
beyond reach of the redemptive power of God."

Cognitive malfunction, huh? So my brain is broken if I don't believe in god. Good to know will punish me forever for having the divine equivalent of aphasia. "Paradigm-induced blindness"? Big words don't actually make you right, you know. "Sensus divinitatis", damage to? Hmmm . . . so I suppose you can produce MRIs or PET scans showing damage to my sensus divinitatis? Yeah, I didn't think so. Besides, if my sensus divinitatis were existent and damaged, why would I go to hell for not believing? That would be like sending someone to hell for being blind or deaf. And dibs on "deadly cognitive cocktail" as a band name. Or possibly a weapon in the next Fallout.

Yeesh. If you want to know why an atheist is an atheist, ask the atheist. Nobody else can tell you, certainly not some Christian apologist with a fetish for big, scientificey words.

Faith Healing: It's a Scam, Get Over It.

I hate people who take advantage of the desperate. They rank right up there with pedophiles. So I think you can understand why I have a special disdain for faith healers, those scam artists that combine the desperation of the incurably ill with the credulity of the faithful. It's a vile business. I have only pity for the desperate who turn to scam artists for help because I understand them. There have been times in my life I would have drunk motor oil if somebody somewhere said it would help. I won't list all the different herbs and supplements and such I have tried. It's embarrassing. Therefore, I have only contempt for those who take advantage of such despair and frustration for those who support it.

This morning I read Luke18:31-43. Jesus told his disciples that
he would be murdered by the Gentiles and then rise from the dead on the third
day. Also, as he walked by a blind man called out to Jesus so he could heal him
of his blindness. Jesus gave him his sight back.

I have witnessed one miraculous healing in Mexico back in August 2006. Our
group was praying for a while for a man paralyzed in his wheelchair. I don't
know how long we prayed but it was for maybe an hour. At the end of it he got up
out of his wheelchair and began to walk. At the end of the mission trip he was
pushing his wheelchair around while his non-paralyzed brother sat it in. Months
later he got a job at a factory. I don't know how he is doing now, since it was
almost four years ago, but I am sure he is doing fine.

It would be difficult to describe everything that is wrong with the above paragraph. First of all, we have no proof the man in the wheelchair was indeed paralyzed. He may have been a perfectly healthy plant. He could have suffered from any of a number of disorders or illnesses that require wheelchair use for medium or long distances, but allow one to stand or walk for short distances, such as pain, fatigue, heart or lung diseases, etc. We don't know and I doubt the writer did either.

Months later he got a job at a factory.

How does the writer know this? Did he see the man at the factory? I doubt it. He was told this and accepted it without question. However, even if the man were legitimately in need of a wheelchair, he could very well have had a self limiting disorder that required him to use a wheelchair and then improved to the point where he was healthy enough to work in a factory. That's assuming the man was ever in need of a wheelchair at all.

I don't know how he is doing now, since it was almost four years ago, but I am
sure he is doing fine.

He could be dead for all the writer knows. That's a ridiculous assumption. If the man has a relapsing/remitting disorder like Multiple Sclerosis, he could well be using a wheelchair as we speak. We have no way of knowing. I don't know if this is more of a study of the scam that is faith healing or the extremes of credulity.

I actually did comment on this post, pointing out all the things we don't know about this story, and this was the response:

Personalfailure... I understand your argument but it is not possible to
scientifically explain miracles because they can't be explained scientifically.
Miracles go above and beyond science. You have to have faith.

LALALALA- I can't heeeeaaaaar you! And really don't waaaaaaaant to!

This wouldn't bother me, but the people harmed in these scams aren't just the faithful, they are the desperately ill. People like me. We've got enough problems, we don't need scam artists preying on us.

Beliefs

evolution, science, creationism, belief,

Often xkcd says what I want to say, but more elegantly than I ever would.

I hate that riddle, too.

Seems Like Thought

jesus, religion, witnessing, evangelism, belief, atheism, atheist

I do enjoy "and this is why you should believe exactly what I believe" speech, because they're always so incredibly stupid. Really, really stupid.

Well I will give you some things that make Christianity different from ALL other religions, although I’m sure this is the short list. well, there's that jesus thing . . .

1. Time itself is based on Jesus Christ. What does the year 2009 AD mean? Okay, a certain dating system is based on Jesus, but that's not time. Time is not the calender. These days, educated people use BCE (Before Common Era) and CE (Common Era), not BC and AD. Also, there are lots of other calendars. You don't hear about them much in the US, but off the top of my head, the Islamic Calendar (current year: 1430 AH), the Jewish Calendar (current year: 5769) and the Chinese Calendar (current year: Ox).

2. The Christian Bible is the most widely translated and widely distributed book ever to exist. So, if the Lord of the Rings becomes the most widely translated and widely distributed book to ever exist, should i start worshipping Gandalf?

3. Some of the predictions in the Bible have already come to pass. It is apparent that others also will. lulz.

4. The Bible has several different authors from different areas and times, yet it blends perfectly. that's amazing! it's almost like later authors were familiar with earlier authors' work . . .

5. Although is has been attempted, the primary truths within any version of the Bible have not changed. i'm not even certain what this refers to. is he saying that different translations have yielded similar results? is he a King James Only advocate?

6. More and more historical accounts in the Bible have been proven to be correct. "historical accounts"? you mean like, 40 years walking across a desert i could personally hobble my way across in less than a week? or the global flood that demonstrably did not happen? i wish this guy would link something.

7. Christianity is the only religion where the ONLY requirement is to accept what God has already done. so it's unique. yippee.

8. Because acceptance is the ONLY requirement, no one has any greater access than anyone else. it's egalitarian. i repeat my sarcastic "yippee", communist!

Yeah, I'm still an atheist.

Context is Everything

bible, translation, christian, christianity, belief,
Hat tip to Bruce*!

تو این قضیه انتخابات ، چیزی که جالب ِ موضع گیری مردم کشور های دیگست .نه اون مردمی که ایرانی هستند و توی کشورهای دیگه زندگی می کنند . اون مردمی که کلاً متعلق به کشورهای دیگه هستند. می خوام براتون یه چیز جالب تعریف کنم. من توی وب سایت پائولو کوئلیو ، نظر دادم و توی فرمش، وب سایتمم گذاشتم. یه دختر آمریکایی نظر منو خوند و توی وبمم نظر داد. می دونید چی اینجا جالبه. این دختر ،نمی تونه فارسی بخونه در نتتیجه نتونسته بود وب منو بخونه و از من خواسته بود که وبشو بخونم. توی وبش اینقدر خوب، با مردم ایران همدردی کرده بود که واقعاً تعجب آور بود و حالا بعد از چند روز و کمی آرام تر شدن جریانات داخلی ، بازم برام نظر گذاشته و گفته هنوز دارم براتون دعا می کنم تا شما هم مثل ما روز استقلال داشته باشید . وبشو میگذارم که اگر شما هم خواستین بخونینش

The above is a blog post by an Iranian named Sarah. At the end is a link to my site. I have no idea what that says. I tried putting it through a translator and got this:

This theorem election you something interesting that the position of countries Dygst. Iranian people nor I are countries دیگه I live. I totally belong to countries who are دیگه. Are defined خوام براتون I do interesting things. My website my Paulo Coelho, I and my comments Frmsh, Web Saytmm put. American girl I Khvnd comment me and I will Vbmm comments. Dvnyd What is fantastic here. This girl, do not wish Bkhvnh in Persian Nttyjh Web Ntvnsth was me and asked me Bkhvnh was Vbshv Bkhvnm. So my good wishes, sympathy with the Iranian people was really surprising was that after a few days now and become a little more relaxed domestic trends, بازم me comments and say that I still pray براتون you like to have our Independence Day be. Vbshv Mygzarm if you Khvastyn Bkhvnynsh.

My point is that the bible is a lot like the above. The bible you've read is a translation of a translation of words written thousands of years ago by people whose lives were entirely unlike our own, originally written in languages now dead. As a historical document, the bible is a fascinating, if confusing, glimpse at times gone by. For any other purpose, well, Vbshv Mygzarm if you Khvastyn Bkhvnynsh.


*clicky the linky, it's an excellent post.

10 Questions from Fallen and Flawed

christianity, atheism, atheist, religion, belief, god, jesus,

Not that they asked me, but Fallen and Flawed has been asking other atheists to answer ten questions about themselves, so, being an atheist, I thought I'd take a crack at it.

1. How would you describe yourself: atheist, agnostic or skeptic? Explain.

Atheist. I have seen no proof of any divine being, therefore I don't believe in any. It's really quite simple.

2. When did you know you were an agnostic atheist? Did it scare you or was it a non-issue?

I'm just an atheist. I was raised Catholic, but no matter how sincere my belief in god and jesus, and it was very sincere, I was always skeptical regarding the dogma of Catholicism. When I say always, I mean back when I was 5, I was questioning hell and purgatory. I went through a spiritual questioning phase in college, but I'd say I was an atheist by about 25. It didn't bother me, it's just the way I was.

I didn't become an atheist activist until I was fired for being an atheist.

3. Ever suffer persecution as an agnostic atheist?

(What's with this "agnostic atheist" thing?) Yes, I was fired for being an atheist. I shared a cubicle with a fundy, and she was always witnessing to me. I told her to stop, she pushed even harder. When it got to the point where I was finding Chick tracts in my purse, the purse I kept hidden away in a drawer, mind you, I complained to management.

The HR rep immediately accused me of being an atheist. I froze. I must've looked like Barb did when she was accused of being a polygamist at the Mother of the Year award banquet. To this day, I don't know why I wasn't quick-witted enough to say something like, "No, I'm Catholic, and it's still offending me!", but I didn't. The HR rep told me that the company didn't need immoral godhaters like me around and had me escorted from the building.

4. What do you want to accomplish with your life?

That's a tough question for me. The hubby and I both suffer from chronic medical conditions that have limited us somewhat physically, so on a lot of days, just getting through the day is an accomplishment.

5. Who are your heroes? Why?

Hmmm. Well, there's Trent Reznor. He overcame a long standing drug addiction that nearly killed him, and now he's raising money for children in need. Or Beethoven. He lost his hearing, which would be the worst possible loss for a musician, and wrote more symphonies. Sonia Sotomayer should be a hero for anyone who's experiencing adversity. She came from nothing, and now it looks like she'll be a Supreme Court Justice.

I admire anyone who's overcome adversity and come back better than ever. They give me hope.

6. What would you like to accomplish with your blog?

I like to think I can raise awareness about issues facing nonbelievers of every stripe (I'm including pagans in this, though they are believers. Pagans get it in the face as much as atheists.), as well as gay rights issues and feminist issues.

7. What’s your favorite part about being an agnostic atheist?

Freedom. I can think what I will (and I can't control my thoughts. I've tried.) without worry about retaliation from the same guy who ordered infants killed. I can read any book I want, watch any movie, talk to anyone.

I love ideas. I love knowledge. I love science. I love that I am free to love all those things without guilt or fear.

8. Are there any Christian concepts that you respect?

Exclusively Christian? No. Concepts like "don't murder" or "love your neighbor" or "give to the poor" are all concepts that I respect, but they are not exclusive to Christianity.

9. Does it irritate you when Christians try to share their faith with you?

If they ever did try to share, no it wouldn't. But they don't try to share, they try to bludgeon me with it. That is irritating. The only example of sharing faith I can think of is the Slacktivist. He truly does share his faith, and I find it amazing.

10. Were you ever a Christian? Would you go back?

Yes, I was Catholic. Would I go back? Right now, no. But I have no idea what the future will bring. Perhaps I will find proof of god someday. Maybe the Rapture will happen. Who knows?

Well, I suppose if you redefine the word . . .

atheism, atheist, makarios, miracle, jesus, god, religion, belief
Makarios redefines miracles in his latest post, Do I Have to Believe?

For the record, a "miracle" is defined as an effect or extraordinary event in the physical world that surpasses all known human or natural powers and is ascribed to a supernatural cause.

Most of the Christians that I’ve met have come to believe in miracles only after they’ve come to know the person of Jesus and His work in their lives. you'll believe once you believe, in other words. we call that circular reasoning. That’s because one of the greatest miracles that we as Christians experience is the real life, real space, real time* transformation that Jesus works in our own lives. and now we've redefined "miracle" to the point of meaninglessness. rising from the dead? a miracle. jesus made me happy? no. The very fact that we believe in, obey, serve, love, adore and worship Creator God is a miracle. No one can bring this about on their own. Atheists agree that, “I couldn’t believe in God even if I wanted to.”

and now we know the difference between hearing and listening. clearly, Makarios has heard what atheists are saying, because i've said that, too. but he's not listening. that doesn't mean that worshipping is an unnatural mental state brought about by miraculous intervention. in fact, worshipping, or at least interpreting natural events as divine, is the default position of human consciousness. what it means is that belief is not something that can be turned off an on like a light switch. you can't believe, or disbelieve, because you want to, any more than one can love, or not love, at will.

On our own we reject the very concept of Creator God. To worship and adore Creator God is absolutely counterintuitive, at least according to what we knew of the world in our pre Christian, pre awareness days. no, it's not counterintuitive. according to psychological studies, atheism is counterintuitive.

Satoshi Kanazawa

You see a bush on fire. It could have been caused by an impersonal, inanimate, and unintentional force (lightning striking the bush and setting it on fire), or it could have been caused by a personal, animate, and intentional force (God trying to communicate with you). The “animistic bias” or “agency-detector mechanism” predisposes you to opt for the latter explanation rather than the former. It predisposes you to see the hands of God at work behind natural, physical phenomena whose exact causes are unknown.

In this view, religiosity (the human capacity for belief in supernatural beings) is not an evolved tendency per se; after all, religion in itself is not adaptive. It is instead a byproduct of animistic bias or the agency-detector mechanism, the tendency to be paranoid, which is adaptive because it can save your life. Humans did not evolve to be religious; they evolved to be paranoid. And humans are religious because they are paranoid.

This is not a miracle- it's a consequence of the way human consciousness works, the way we perceive the world. The only way to consider this a miracle is to redefine miracle to the point of everything being a miracle. In fact, by Makarios' redefinition of miracle, atheism would be the miracle.


Just to avoid the obvious theist objection:

This is not to say that the human bias towards perceiving god in every gust of wind disproves god. It doesn't. Just because we're biased towards perceiving something doesn't mean that something doesn't exist. I'm scared of spiders. Every time I see something out of the corner of my eye, I assume it's a spider. (I spend a lot time jumping.) 99 times out of 100, there is no spider. In fact, at least 90 of those times, it's my own hair. Every so often, though, it is a spider.


*I suspect this to be a rather odd reference to the reality of spacetime.