The End of Days: Indistinguishable From All Other Days

Okay, so at the End of Times there will be: earthquakes, floods, storms, wars and rumors of wars.

So, you know, business as usual on the planet Earth.

As far as prophecy goes, that's like predicting that there will be people, eating food and drinking beverages. Somewhere. In the vicinity of the prophecied activity.

But these signs- they are now! (Well, sure, they are always.)

This is just another strange event...I am constantly in awe by the pure reluctant acceptance of the general populace to the signs around us. I have discussed the earthquakes, volcanoes, hurricanes, pestilences, turmoil in the Middle East and the state of Israel to just about anyone who will talk to me about it and it seems they always come back with the same answer.... It has always been like this! We just didn't have the technology to realize it. It makes me sad that people are just so blind to what is happening. I want people to get right with God to turn back to him. However, it seems that the ME society has finally taken over and they have no room for our Creator! I wish I knew the magic words to open their eyes.....Come Lord Jesus Come!

Psst! You, yeah, you. C'mere. Generally speaking, when you're the only person who can see a thing, that's because it's not actually there. I mean, I suppose it's possible that white horse in the garden is a unicorn, but more than likely, you are delusional.

Seriously, has there ever been a time when there weren't earthquakes, volcanoes, hurricanes, pestilences, and turmoil in the Middle East (and everywhere else)? Go get a history book, read it and then get back to me.

I wish I knew the magic words too

Me, too! That's be sweet! Oh, you mean to convince me that earthquakes are highly unusual events. Never mind.

I found a correlation to these times at work the other day. My coworker Leslie spoke over the loudspeakers to warn customers that the store would be closing in 10 minutes, and people kept on shopping, some came to the front. She then warned that the store would be closing in five minutes. People started coming to the front then.

I realized that on a much wider and less petty scale, this is what the Lord has been doing since 1948. The store is closing, but people are still doing their shopping while those who are listening have gone to the checkout. Soon the store will close and people who didn't listen will be trapped overnight.

Um, wut? What does "correlation" mean again? Do you warn your customers that the store is closing by setting the displays on fire? I . . . wut?

Great Analogy! I could not agree more! It just saddens me to see the blind walking everywhere!

Damn blind people! Stick to your . . . blind . . . places.

Remember hurricane Katrina. Weren't the people being warned four or five days ahead of expected landfall. Many didn't heed the warning and the landfall and the breaking of the levee caused a lot more damage and loss of life than anyone anticipated or could have imagined.

Oh, you mean the poor people who had no way to get out of town and nowhere to go even if they did get out? That makes this analogy . . . interesting.

I'll end with the most disturbing thing I've ever read (and I've read the Bible):

With fish and game comissions trying to rid the US of invasive-destructive species,

starlings have always been a scourge, and remember the snake head fish infestation, should we be surprised when this kind of thing happens?

With toxic spills and weather system changes, fish will suffer very quickly.

All we need is some massive land animal die-offs.

Certianly these events need investigation, cause identification, as there may be a serious health threat to humans.

But This isn't God's handiwork. God would kill every starling on the face of the earth. God's signs leave no doubt.

satan on the other hand, loves to play games, and if these occurances get lots of christians proclaiming "signs of the times"

Well, that will be fuel for scoffers wouldn't it. "So where is your long expected Jesus?"


But then that is real Prophecy coming to fruition, isn't it?


No one knows the day, but act like the time is short - be busy until He sounds the Quitting Time Whistle.

You'll know it's god by the incredible scale of death and suffering. Um, yeah. I'm sure the Egyptians, looking at their dead first born children would agree.

You're Not Helping Your Case

atheism, atheist, suffering, makarios, christian, god,

The suffering question. It the sticking point for many people when considering the concept of a caring deity. You can answer the suffering question a number of ways, the easiest two being the pagan answer, deities are not all powerful and cannot prevent most suffering, or you can go all Christian about it and declare "ineffable!*", which is essentially cheating.

Any other explanation is just cruelty. Cruelty on a scale I can't imagine anyone really being comfortable with, though apparently some people are.

This, I believe is perhaps the single greatest reason for why God allows suffering and tragedy to take place. These things solidify our opinions about God. Suffering causes us to either reject God or humble ourselves before God.

Yesterday, I needed help to stand up. Every damn time I wanted to stand up. I'm 33 years old. It was painful, it was humiliating and it was terrifying. I spent the day restricting my fluid intake in order to cut down on urination, because, as a girl, I pee sitting down . . . and I couldn't get back up by myself. So my hips hurt and I felt like I'd run a marathon through the Sahara. Fortunately, I was babysitting my 10 year old niece, and she was cool about it.

According to Makarios, god did that to me to force a reaction out of me. First of all: psychotic. If I started torturing people to get a reaction out of them, you would rightly condemn me to prison for the rest of my life. Secondly: we've already gotten a reaction here, so why keep doing it? I've rejected god, we should be done now, right? The same can be said for believers that continue to suffer. They've gotten down on their knees, now leave them the fuck alone.

Basically, Makarios, and all the others like him, think of god as a little kid pulling the wings off of flies just to see what will happen. Newsflash: that's not a good thing.

Seriously. People just piss me off.



*In case you're not familiar with "ineffable!", it's that the mind of god is not something mortals can comprehend, so stop trying and just go with it. Sorry, but my mind will go to the off position the day I die and not one moment beforehand.

Full on Stockholm Syndrome

job, suffering, god, bible, ministry, rapture, ready

The people at Rapture Ready are actually getting weirder. In the "I think I'll cut off my own toes, one by one, and eat them, just to prove my devotion to cheese" sense of weird.

It's a little scary.

sunshine2777 belies his or her name with the following incredibly disturbing question:

We all have different ministries in our life but does anyone know if suffering in and of itself is a ministry to others? Of course the primary one I'm thinking of is Job...... there were others in the bible though. I hope I'm making sense but I truly want to know if long and continual suffering is or can be a ministry to others... to encourage others and to help them see God. If this is in the wrong place, please move it mods. Thanks!

first of all, suffering as a ministry? seriously? hey, PF, you have a horrible, painful disease that will cause unrelenting agony for decades, you can thank me later! what?!

and Job? Job is the book of the bible in which god allows satan to torment a faithful believer for no good reason. just to prove a point. and it's not just what happens to job- job's children are all killed. so innocent people die and an innocent man is tormented in increasingly horrible ways, just because god felt like it.

that's psychopathic. seriously, when psychopaths torture innocent victims for no particular reason, we condemn them, we imprison them, we execute them. god does it, and everyone says, "god is love!" wtf?!

Obadiah and Anddra have the same reaction:

I don't think suffering in and of itself is a ministry, but by the grace of God and the power of the Spirit you can utilize it in ministry

join me in worshipping god, and you can suffer just like everyone else! what? that is the upside!

sunshine2777 clarifies:

Maybe I should have worded it a bit differently. Suffering and then "handling it well according to we know to be true, our faith, etc". Does that make more sense? Would God hand someone that kind of ministry, where the devil is allowed to pound someone and with God's help and grace, they react to it in total faith and worship. I know, Job comes to mind. But what about today? Any thoughts? Oh yea, thanks Obadiah... I didn't think anyone would respond...

that would be the plot of The Exorcism of Emily Rose

anddra offers up possible the most disturbing reaction to the Book of Job possible:

Whilst the way a Christian handles suffering can be a powerful witness, I don't see it as a ministry in its own right. As for Job, I think he was the principle beneficiary of what he went through.

so, suffering unimaginable torments and watching all your children die at once is a feature, not a glitch? hey, where can i get me some of that?

i swear, if anyone in real life told me that they frequent Rapture Ready, I wouldn't turn my back on them. ever.

Proving God Through Evil

religion, religious, suffering, evil, good, christian, jesus, god, atheism, atheist, atheophobia, asshat
Trying to deal with the existence of evil is a dangerous game for a Christian to play. Some do it quite well. The Slacktivist handles the evil question every so often with delicacy and panache. (Yes, I have quite the crush on Fred, which is a little embarrasing for an atheist.) Most Christians, however, are not Fred. That leads to the following:



Where is God when a little girl gets raped - Part 3



by Rod Holmgren



Nobody except for Ray Comfort hates atheists more than Rod Holmgren. In fact, you'd think atheists burned down Mr. Holmgren's house, with his dog in it, while anally raping his grandmother and pouring sugar into the gas tank of his classic Mustang. Mr. Holmgren is clearly more intelligent than Mr. Comfort, but that's not really saying much.



A fellow traveller in life’s journey, F, once stated, “But since you believe in [God] you must blame him [for] floods, earthquakes and of course rapes. Of course, all these things happen because THERE IS NO GOD.”



actually, all those things happen because they happen. saying they happen because there is no god implies that if there were a god, they wouldn't happen, which is rather silly, but i agree with the point i think F was trying to make.



Another atheist wrote, “for what purpose could God possibly permit so much evil to be in the world?” good question. nobody, not even Fred, really has an answer for that.



First of all, to find the answer to, Where is God?, one does not ask an atheist. indeed, if one wants to know the location of god, it would be rather useless to ask someone that doesn't believe in god, but . . . Atheists are alienated in their relationship with their Creator.



For the last fucking time, we are not in a relationship with the nonexistent skydaddy, alienated or otherwise, any more than Christians are in an alienated relationship with Odin or Thor. Stop it.



Getting an accurate depiction of God from an atheist is like getting an accurate rendering of the justice system from a career criminal.



Actually, a career criminal would be the best source of accurate information possible for how the justice system really works. Who could possibly know better?



Therefore, the following is garnered both from what the Bible tells us about God look, using the bible to prove god to an atheist is both bad form and pointless. yes, i understand that you like your skydaddy book. i prefer the harry potter series. i consider them to be equally valid, in case you didn't pick that up. and suffering as well as from Christians themselves as they describe their journey through tragedy and suffering. anecdotal evidence is not evidence. it's nice and all that the skydaddy makes you feel better, but what does that prove? What we find from those sources i think it should be written "sources" is that:



. God is with believers in their suffering. for future reference, if you're ever with me while i'm being raped, don't stand there, "with me in my suffering". DO SOMETHING! i expect that of any human being, i expect a bit more out of an omnipotent being.



- Whether we sense His presence or not just cause you can't feel it, doesn't mean it's not there is not logic, God is with us as any loving parent is with a child who has just been hurt. god is omnipotent and omniscient. i don't expect a loving parent to necessarily know when their child is being hurt, i do expect an omnipotent and omniscient being to know. and, again, i expect a little more than comfort afterwards. unless you think being a good parent involves watching your child get raped and then stepping in to comfort them afterwards. I happen to know firsthand about years of childhood sexual assault. i'm sorry about that. no one should have to experience such a thing. While I wasn’t a Christian until I was thirty-years-old, I can see clearly how it was God’s tender mercy that sustained me through that and much more as life went on. I don’t expect His presence to end - ever! okay. i don't get the atheophobia, but i do get the extreme need for christianity. this is why i never try to defaith people. some people really need their beliefs.



Mr. Holmgren, you are more than welcome to believe in any god(s) you want. However, please stop attacking atheists. We aren't hurting you. It isn't necessary to attack us. Please take a page from my pagan friends who believe what they believe, even pray for me, but never take a swipe at my lack of belief. (Thanks, guys!)



God is able and does bring good out of the things that satan uses to destroy us.


This argument is the theological version of "every black cloud has a silver lining". while it's nice that you can find good in bad things, it doesn't prove god.


- God is working in us the good that is spoken of in Romans 8:29. That good is the development of Christ-like character. God is able to bring that about in all the things that may happen to us during our lives.. God is with the meek, the humble, the merciful. so why aren't you meek and humble?

- “God opposes the proud, but give grace to the humble.” Therefore atheists should not be surprise or confounded when Christians seem to experience tragedy in a way that is different from pagans or atheists. i have yet to see christians experiencing tragedy in any way differently from atheists and pagans. “We do not grieve as those who have no hope.”. i have hope, Mr. Holmgren. In fact, it is atheism that gives me hope. His presence sustains those who love Him and follow Him.

this goes on for quite some time until we get to this little gem:

First, God used the Nazi Holocaust as a means to reunite the nation of Israel, as was prophesied 3,000 years earlier. God is going to bring to fulfilment His plans for humanity and the gates of hell will not be able to stand against it. Still to come is the destruction of nations that try to remove Israel from the world stage, even as Israel becomes like "a huge stone around the neck of the world." This also was predicted thousands of years ago.

great, merciful yhwh killed 6 million Jews, 2-3 million Soviet POWs, 2 million ethnic Poles, 1.5 million Romani, 250,000 disabled persons, 200,000 Freemasons, 15,000 homosexuals, and 5,000 Jehovah's Witnesses to bring about prophecy. That's good? That's desirable?

Oh, sorry, guys, you got in the way of my prophecy. You understand, I'm sure.

I'm sure the families of those 15 MILLION dead people were just thrilled to be a part of it all.

. . .

Or, as with atheists, it might be physical or emotional safety that we depend upon. who doesn't depend upon physical and emotional safety? as if christians are in the habit of living in burning buildings. In fact, atheists seem personally offended when tragic things happen, even in someone else’s life.

yes, we are capable of empathy, asshat. That's what it's called when you hurt for someone else. you know who doesn't get upset when they hear about a child being raped? a sociopath, that's who. you are condemning us for the sin of empathy. that's really something.

. . .

There are so many benefits to suffering, there are so many obvious answers to the question of “Why would God allow evil in the world?” that it’s surprising that atheists seem dazed, confused and oblivious to any of them. okay, this I gotta see.

For example:. Suffering brings into a relationship with God, those who have been predestined to such a journey.- You never know that God is all you need until God is all that you have.”. oh, dear, we have a calvinist here.

IN WHICH CASE, WHY ARE YOU FUCKING PICKING ON ATHEISTS? EITHER WE'RE PREDESTINED TO BELIEVE OR WE'RE PREDESTINED TO NOT BELIEVE, BUT EITHER WAY IT'S NOT OUR FAULT!

sorry for the shouting, but wading through pages of bullshit to find out that this asshat thinks everything is predetermined by god, including my atheism, and he's still abusing me for my atheism, is really frustrating.

i give up. you're on your own if you want to continue with this bullshit.