Reaping What Others Sow

hatred, bigotry, traditional, marriage, gay, same sex, dna, ufi,

Since the beginning, traditional marriage advocates have claimed that preventing gays from marrying has nothing to do with bigotry against gays. "We like the gays! They're our friends! We just don't think they should get to marry."

Bullshit.

Now that bigotry is law in Maine, the true face of traditional marriage has come out into the open. It's not pretty.

goinbroke of kingfield, ME

Nov 11, 2009 9:37 AM

Does anyone know where we can get window stickers that indicate that this particular business is not homosexual friendly? think of it as an anti-rainbow flag. It's about time we "came out" and let the homosexuals from away know how Mainers feel about seeing their sick side show act in our cities and towns.

See above, goinbroke. We did that for many years in this country, to blacks, hispanics, and the irish to name a few. It's something we used to be ashamed of. We still should be ashamed.

Chinook of portland, ME

Nov 8, 2009 9:41 PM
goinbroke of kingfield, ME Nov 8, 2009 8:51 PM

Bob, ... ...Also the next time you are in a business or a resturant and are waited on by some flaming gay guy or lesbian, ask for another server. Simple enough as the customer has the right to be "uncomfortable" as they say. Nothing personal just go away. Mainers can vote with their pocketbook and the homosexuals will get the message and leave. This happens all the time in San Francisco.----------

(What does a "flaming lesbian" look like? I'm unable to picture that.) So, people in San Francisco leave restaurants when the waiter is gay? All the time? Nobody eats out in San Fran, I guess. Also, if you ask for another server in that situation, I sincerely hope the cook wipes his ass with your food, because spitting in your food doesn't quite seem enough.

I very much fear that gays in Maine will soon be reaping what people like the DNA, UFI, the Catholic Church, the Mormons, et al. have sown: hatred. The bigots have won, and now they feel free to put up "No Gays Allowed" posters and refuse to interact with them in public. We can all guess what happens next, and I will be holding each and every one of you bigots personally responsible.

UPDATE: Are you missing valuable opportunities to express your bigotry while barbecuing, walking your dog or just breathing? Then buy one of these lovely MAN + WOMAN ONLY tshirts, aprons or doggy shirts!

Somebody keep me away from the internet before I do myself harm.

The Arguments, They're Getting Weird

homophobia, traditional, marriage, gay, same sex, stupid, dna,
It's almost like the antigay (traditional) marriage crowd has run out of vaguely logical arguments and debunked science, and have been forced to choose between two courses of action: really weird arguments or yelling FAG! at the top of their lungs.

From Euripides we have Some Guy in a 3,000 Year Old Poem Said Stuff:

I was reading Victor Davis Hanson and John Heath's book Who Killed Homer? and found this gem. Odysseus, the hero of the Odyssey encounters a young woman, Nausicaa, on the beach. In speaking with her, he gives a speech about the values of married life:

Nothing is better, he suggests, than when a husband and wife share a house and their hearts, "a great pain to their enemies [the ill-minded ones] and a joy to their friends [the well-minded ones], and they themselves are highly esteemed" (p. 191).

I haven't read the Oddysey in a while, but how many times did Oddyseus cheat on his wife? I can think of Calypso and Circe right off the top of my head. Beyond that, marriage among the ancient Greeks had about as much to do with modern US marriage as a firefly has to do with nuclear power.

From PomegranateApple we get Marriage Fills Chairs (and we wouldn't want empty chairs, now would we?):

My friends always laugh when they walk into the house where I live. There are so many chairs. (You can’t see the rest of the room. There are more chairs.) Way more chairs than we need in the house. I mean, it’s funny.

It normal to me, because growing up, whenever I visited my grandparents’ house: they were never enough chairs.

Ummmm . . . marriage doesn't fill chairs, people do. I guess gay people can't get a roomful of people together to fill up chairs?

The every amusing Opine Editorials gives us a title and a link. When Young Men Are Scarce, They're More Likely to Play the Field Than to Propose. In other news, if the only ice cream available is vanilla, I'll take vanilla. If there are 31 flavors available, I'll probably pick something else.

The good here is that these arguments make for amusing reading. The bad is, soon they'll be left with nothing but yelling FAG!

Derailing for Dummies

dna, derailing, dummies, minority, privileged, homophobia, homosexual, gay, feminism, funny, religious, right,
Not sure how to maintain your Privileged Person(tm) status against all those Marginalized Persons(tm)? Read Derailing for Dummies, your guide to conversational dominance! (DNA, I'm looking at you!)

Can We Say Disingenuous

religion, religious, morality, mormon, lds, homophobia, homosexual, marriage, tradition, traditional, gay, dna, rockwood, angela,

I would like to be upfront with you: when I offer you an argument, it's an argument I believe in. I truly believe it, I truly feel that way, and, when you read my words, you're getting an honest look at the way I think and feel. You're not getting unlimited access to my every thought, but the thoughts I share represent exactly what I really think.



I mention this, because in lurking around the bigotsphere, I came across this gem from our friend, Beetlebabee, aka Angela Rockwood, Director of/for/in the DNA. She not only admits to being disingenuous* at best in her arguments against same sex marriage, she encourages others to follow her down the yellow brick road of hiding one's true intentions.



Comment by beetlebabee on March 8, 2009 at 6:09pm


In order to be effective in the marriage debate arena i.e., making sure homosexuals remain second class citizens, I think it's important to focus on love more than we focus on the sin. is this some new definition of "love" I am unfamiliar with? this, from the woman who has said, repeatedly, that marriage is not about love? pick a side, angie! While rejecting the behavior, Christ never rejected the soul. love the sinner, hate the sin. as if gay were a sin. way to frame the argument, ange. It doesn't do us any good to focus on "those sinners" with our fingers pointed out. it might do you some good to focus on "those sinners" with your fingers pointed inward, however. We've got to do a better job of articulating our position beyond just "That's nasty" or "that's evil". that's right, angie's not above reducing homosexuals to second class citizens because gay sex makes her feel squicky, and apparently she can't stop thinking about it.



There are a whole array of points that are infinitely more persuasive than opining on someone else's level of righteousness. glad you've noticed that, but it is highly disingenuous to go out there and propound on the other arguments, when you're real problem is that the bible, or the book of mormon, told you so. You know what I mean? be as insincere as possible? We're all sinners at some point, but those gays just won't quit! so let's move beyond that and talk about the other arguments that are out there. not the arguments that really represent our viewpoint, the other ones.



When I debate, I never use the word "sodomite" for instance because it's unbelievably rude?, because it pidgeonholes or possibly pigeonholes me immediately as someone who believes in religion as the basis for my argument. no, it outs you as a nasty bigot. who the fuck says "sodomite" anymore, other than Westboro Baptist? and if you're not familiar with Westboro, just type "god hates fags" into a search engine and see what comes up. While that is very true that you're a nasty bigot?, religion is my basis and my rock good for you, leave the rest of us out of it., it's not the only proof out there supporting traditional marriage, religion isn't proof. it's faith. two different things. and the reality is, that hearts and minds close to the truth very quickly if you take religion as your main defense. because the rest of us can tell the difference between truth and religion. of course, we're not mormons.



For me, Religion is my basic foundation. i'm glad for you, now stop trying to legislate it all over the rest of us. Because I believe in the scriptures and, again i'm glad for you, now stop trying to legislate it all over the rest of us. , and the word of God, I know that homosexuality is not the path to happiness. not for you. not for me, either. wtf does that have to do with anything? Because I know that, I know that studies and other proofs will automatically follow. oh, dear. the bible/book of mormon said so, therefore, there MUST be proof out there somewhere. we just need to find it. this is called "confirmation bias" ange. it's not how science works, it's not how logical argumentation works, but thanks for sharing. So, I focus on a broader base, truth. so, religion isn't truth? i'm getting a little confused here. Because everyone is searching for truth. except people who already know it, like you.



People will be much more open to our line of thinking if we come at it from the arena of truth, rather than overt religion well, yeah, but that's still disingenuous.....even though at heart they are the same. at your heart, not at mine.



just my two cents. i added at least another $1.50. i'm generous like that.



*disingenuous, for those unfamiliar with the word and lazy about the clicking, means lacking in frankness, candor, or sincerity; falsely or hypocritically ingenuous; insincere

How Gay Marriage Skews Statistics

gay, marriage, homophobia, homosexual, tradition, dna, duncan, voice, prop 8
During today's Voice of a Nation, the guest, William C. Duncan, director of the Marriage Law Foundation (was it really necessary for me to listen to the program to know what he said?) said that the reason the "traditional marriage" crowd is "losing" in New England is because "marriage is weakest there."

Oh, really?

Perhaps Mr. Duncan simply equates "allowing gays to marry" with "weak marriage", but let's take a look at some dumdumdum statistics. (Ya know, science!)

According to the CDC's website, the rate of divorce (obviously the weakest point of a marriage) in New England is (as of 2004):

Connecticut* 2.4 (per thousand)
Maine 4.3
Massachusetts * 2.2
New Hampshire 3.9
Vermont 3.9

Now let's compare those rates to some other places in the United States.

Arizona** 4.2
Tennessee** 4.9
Arkansas** 6.1
Idaho** 5.0
Kentucky** 4.9
Utah** 4.1
Wyoming 5.2
Alabama 4.9

Clearly, gay marriage does skew marriage statistics***- toward stronger marriage and less divorce.

*allows gay marriage
**bans gay marriage
***yeahyeahyeah correlation does not equal causation, but there is definitely something going on there.

Rainbow Reclamation

homophobia, homosexual, gay, marriage, rainbow, stupid, asshat, dna, tradition, traditional,

Asshats in the traditional marriage "it's not marriage unless you're hetero and obeying gender stereotypes" bigotsphere keep trying to "take back" symbols from the LGBT community, specifically, in this instance*, rainbows.

I suppose you might want some explanation as to why your Ironymeter(tm) just imploded, leaving a small, unstable black hole hovering one inch above your desk. (Don't worry, Ironymeter(tm) tech support has a solution for that, but your desk will never be quite the same again.)

Rainbows naturally represent diversity, as they contain every color in the visible light spectrum. (Actually, they probably contain colours outside of the spectrum we can perceive, but obviously I wouldn't know about that.) The reason you now share desk space with a small, unstable black hole is that it is the height of irony- irony too powerful to be entirely contained in this universe- for a group of people that want everyone to be exactly the same to try and use the rainbow as their symbol.

Symbol fail.

I suggest asshats such as these adopt a more appropriate symbol for their cause: specifically a black square. It would be honest, informative and as ugly as their viewpoint.

*I would invite anyone with a basic knowledge of science to instruct dear Yours, Sincerely on the multitude of science fails contained within the initial two paragraphs. Do avoid being rude, please. Try to invoke Steven J's patience in explaining basic evolutionary theory to Ray Comfort ad nauseum.

Transcript of the first Voice of the Nation

homophobia, homosexual, obama, united, nations, resolution, gay, prop 8, marriage, tradition, angela, rockwood, drew, dna, ufi, united, families
In case you missed it (and I certainly hope you did), here is a reaction transcript of Drew and Angie talking homophobia. It will probably work best if you read along as you listen to the stupidity, but feel free to try it without. (It gets VERY interesting down at the end, if you feel like skipping ahead.)

Um, um, um, um, um

Angie’s protecting my freedom? Really? Because she seems to want to take it away. Funny how people who talk about freedom the most are the ones who like freedom the least.

kinda

Um, um, um, um, um,

Kind of

Um, um, um, um,

Gay marriage is the fight of the century? Seriously? We’re in an economic meltdown the likes of which was last seen during the great depression and her homophobia is the fight of the century?

Kinda

Um, um, um

So

Uh, um, um, um

You know, I guess

Ah, ah, um, uh, um, kinda, um, uh

California, Iowa, Minnesota

Um, um, uh, ah, um, um

Voters voted for it.

Vermont, Minnesota

Um, um, um, uh, ah, um

Florida gay adoption battle

debunked studies, misunderstandings of difference between sex and gender (for the last time people, sex is what genitalia you are born with, gender refers to societal expectations based on those genitalia.)

Democrats suck!

Um, ah, um, um, uh, ah

More debunked studies, plugging UFI, asskissing between UFI and DNA

MSM, think of the children!, gender, science- it's science!

um, uh, um, uh

back to Vermont

one man and one woman

um, um, uh, ah, um, um, ah

Laura Knaperek, works at UFI, is the "inaugural guest", is a conservative's conservative who knows how to "bring it".

The UN rules the world! Run, it's Ban Ki-Moon!

Laura is both easily excited and easily impressed.

UFI's history: Women who hate feminists started UFI in 1978 to protest to the UN, hence becoming, well, a certain kind of female activists, which could be referred to . . . I think you can see where I'm going with this. They're certainly not at home, raising children and baking pies.

And then, Angie rather obliquely replies to me. She asks Laura why protesting nonbinding UN resolutions is so very important. See, I had a post in response to a post of hers that pointed out that the UN does not rule the world. So, Angie's question is aimed at me. The answer she gets is . . . interesting.

Basically, Laura states that sovereign nations create laws based on UN nonbinding resolutions. Laura's being disingenuous here. Every member nation of the UN is free to sign or not sign nonbinding resolutions. Even when they are ratified, they are, as the name implies, nonbinding. The fact of the matter is, a nation that signs a UN resolution is doing so because they already have, or intend to have, similar laws in their own country. A country entirely opposed to such a law would not sign the resolution. I suppose the argument could be made that if many countries have a certain law- say decriminalizing homosexuality- other countries might be peer pressured into creating a similar law, however, that seems unlikely. I highly doubt Iran is going to be peer pressured into being nice to gays.*

Also, using this same logic, we can see that ideas are dangerous, in that we make laws out of them!

Reproductive health services are BAD!BAD!BAD! Poor women around the world should NOT be allowed pap smears and birth control.

Gender stereotypes are good!

To these asshats, abstinence is HIV prevention. Of course, if your husband comes to the marriage with HIV, abstinence isn't really going to help you. Oh, and condoms=promiscuous sex. Who knew?

Laura is now arguing that homosexuals should not have human rights, and should be subject to the death penalty. Charming.

Now Drew tries to back away from that, stating that UFI does think homosexuals should have human rights, but shouldn't be recognized by the UN. That's the ticket. And not at all what Laura said.

Laura doesn't even try to agree with him. Drew gets uncomfortable. Angie agrees with Laura. Nobody likes Obama.

What can you do to help UFI? Go to the website, give them money, money, money, do what they tell you, bother your congressman, blog.

Kiss butt, kiss butt, see you next week.

*When you find yourself on the same page as Iran when it comes to human rights, you took a wrong turn at Albuquerque. A really wrong turn.

When I Am King

end the lies, liar, fear, fearmongering, dna, homophobia, homosexual, gay, prop 8, bigotry
You will be first again the wall / With your opinion which is of no consequence at all.

Radiohead, Paranoid Android

Nominate your favorite "voice of fear" to be on the wall at End the Lies. It's fun!

The DNA Continues to Define Two-Faced

dna, gay, homophobia, homosexual, marriage, adoption, children, stupid,
Once again, the DNA gives us an excellent example of what "two-faced" means.

Exhibit "A": members of the DNA protesting the use of government funds to advertise the benefits of allowing gays to adopt children.

Exhibit "B": members of the DNA happily supporting the use of government funds to advertise the benefits of marriage.

So, are we in such a fiscal crisis that we can't use money to promote social programs, or not? Which is it, asshats?

The Two-Faced DNA Calls Out the Two-Faced Media

octuplets, prop 8, ivf, dna, stupid,
(or, Fun with Comments)

EuripidesDoesn'tKnowWhatAncientGreekDidWithTheirSpareTime is all up in arms about the two-faced media picking on the unemployed single mother with 6 children who deliberately chose to have 8 more embryos implanted at once.

I find this extra hysterical in light of the below comments from members of the DNA in reaction to the exact same story.

Pearl said: Okay, bad news is that the father and mother are not married. That's a travesty for these kids. But the good news is that she refused to kill her unexpected multiples.

the pomegranateapple said: this is a very weird story. i'm so happy to see someone caring about life before birth, but i'm concerned that she purposefully implanted without a father.

Pearl responding to another commenter: Apparently the mother and father of the children are unwed. The mother has declared bankruptcy, is not a US citizen and has no intention of becoming one, and they are living on public assistance. And then there comes the question of why she did IVF if she already had six children. Don't get me wrong; I'm not saying we should regulate number of children, but it's obvious that she didn't need IVF to get pregnant, so was it to purposefully birth multiples? And to what end? Anyway, these are my new questions. I stand by my applaud for her decision to preserve life, even while I wonder...

So tell me, what part about that was any less two-faced than the media's coverage of the same story?

The Inner Workings of the DNA

501c3, dna, marriage, prop 8, traditional, homophobia, homosexual, gay, religion, conservative, family, values

If you've been paying attention, I spend a lot of my time chipping away at the Digital Network Army- the online portion of the traditional marriage crowd. (It's the bigotry, but it's also the abuse of irony, sarcasm, science and logic. I get it, you hate Teh Gay, but what did irony every do to you?)

Through careful detective work (I clicked on a link*), I learned a bit about how the Digital Network Army is organized.

(1) Their Team Captains' profiles are hidden. Hmmmm.

(2) Said Team Captains send out viral emails- marching orders for the unhidden foot soldiers, which no doubt explains why the same post ends up on so many blogs.

(3) If a member receives a comment that can't be moderated away for profanity (they want to look all fair and stuff), but can't be easily dismissed, they can alert the Team Captain, who will email the rest of the Digital Network Army, and they will then swoop in and carpet bomb comment: post so many happy comments that the offending comment disappears in the mix.

Here is a recent viral email assignment from the mysterious Team Captain:

Hello, my fellow traditional marriage supporters!My colleagues in the Digital Network Army (DNA) and I want you to join in our letter-writing campaign today to the editor of the New York Times, following up to the article that ran today about the H8 maps.

NY Times instructions for submitting:Letters for publication should be no longer than 150 words, must refer to an article that has appeared within the last seven days, and must include the writer's address and phone numbers. No attachments, please.

Send a letter to the editor by e-mailing letters@nytimes.com.

Go viral, my dear ones! Thanks for standing up for marriage and for the donors' right to privacy!

So, there you have it: organized bigotry in the new millenium.

*a note on the link: you will have to wade through some serious sycophantery, but there is some very interesting information to be had. including the comment by thejournalistachronicle in which she outs at least one church for violating the rules of the 501(c)3.