Thursday, December 10, 2009

Ouch! No, It Was All Lulz

facepalm, atheism, atheist, christmas, christian, bigotry,
I am the General of an Army of Trolls! Christmas Trolls! This makes my day, though I hope it doesn't obligate me to deliver presents to all the bad little girls and boys, because the sleigh's in the shop and the reindeer seem to have come down with Swine Flu*, so bad timing on that one.

I would like to address certain points in blackngoldfan's rant, starting with:

In checking Troll #1's website (I know you're reading this; yes I did.), I found a post about how, despite being an atheist, they still celebrate Christmas. This, my friends, is hypocrisy. Troll #1 (and you know who you are), you CANNOT celebrate Christmas if you are truly an atheist. Your giving of gifts to friends and family is an acknowledgment that the Magi brought gifts to the Christ child, the basis of the gift-giving tradition. This story is told in the Bible, so you must recognize the religious meaning behind Christmas if you engage in gift-giving.

I'm looking at your blog, and it's pretty clear you have a Christmas tree, my dear. That hideous background doesn't celebrate baby Jesus, it's all secular decorations. Where is decorating trees in the Bible? Nowhere. Christmas trees come from a pagan tradition, as do gift giving and caroling, which means you are currently celebrating, and have been for probably your entire life, pagan gods. Good for you, you hellbound heathen.

In the realm of proving my point, it is indeed wrong to say "screw the blacks/jews", and even though Jews choose to be Jewish in the same sense atheists choose to be atheists, we just shouldn't even mention Jews. It's wrong. Mostly because blackngoldfan hates atheists, but feels uncomfortable with the whole Jewish thing.

Troll #2 came running to the defense of Troll #1 saying that the comment about Jews and Blacks was just trying to prove the point that saying "Screw Atheists", as Mr. Balsamico did, is on a par with racial slurs. How anyone can equate someone practicing a godless religion by choice with the God-given color of one's skin still has my brain hurting. Yes, Jews do practice their faith by choice, but after what Jews endured over many generations, I say they're off limits.

Blackngoldfan is unceasingly nasty to atheists, and then wonders why someone wouldn't want to publicly be known as an atheist. *facepalm*

Troll #4 replied to my BOF's comment by basically saying that WE who may agree with Mr. Balsamico are haters. Troll #4 has blocked anyone from viewing their profile. If you're so proud to be an atheist, why hide it?

I repeat, facepalm.

The whole issue these little libs have is that someone dared to stand up to them and say "Screw you!" Their widdle feewings must be hurt, so they're going to whine and whine about how they are the minority and how wrong it is to say such hurtful things. That's all it boils down to. They're young, 20-something Generation-Me members who have been raised in the religion of political correctness and that the only thing that matters is how they feel.

So, you rant like a deranged dingo if someone challenges you, but anti-atheist bigotry is okay and we need to stop whinging? Do you own a mirror, and if so, what do you see when you look in it?

I liked this best, though:

I won't taint my site with your PC comments.

Something that can taint you is something that can stick to you and affect you even if you don't want it to. I love the idea that tolerance could be like that. As if, having viewed a few too many pleas for an end to bigotry, blackngoldfan might wake up one day and be unable to hate those different from her anymore. Utter bullshit, but now it's my Christmas wish.

*Called "American Flu" in the Middle East, according to my Middle Eastern news feed. Also muches lulz.


  1. Oh that's just sad. You can not celebrate the pagan holiday Blackngoldfan. As a pagan I forbid it. You find the actual date of Jesus and celebrate it then (hint, in the spring). Get your hypocrisy off my celebration of the rebirth of the God.
    See, kind of sucks when we do it to you, doesn't it blackngoldfan? So knock it off. We've shared for a long time, so can you.

  2. Wait, wait, wait. Did this person (and I use the term in the loosest possible sense) just tell me that I can't celebrate Christmas? As though exchanging gifts is a sacrament in which unbelievers can't take part? That's funny.

    But what really struck me as funny was this: "The First Amendment is in full effect for now, and we will exercise our right to freedom of speech under such." Yes, that's right. The First Amendment gives you the right to say (or agree with someone saying) 'Screw atheists!' in public. The First Amendment also gives us the right to point out that the sentiment being expressed is rude, bigoted, and frankly a little stupid.

    What the First Amendment does not do is give you the right make comments like that and remain free from criticism. Constitutional Understanding: FAIL.

    And then there's this: "I won't tolerate racial slurs." But apparently you will tolerate - indeed, celebrate! - slurs against the irreligious. I'm guessing you believe that they deserve it?

  3. Oh, you are kidding, right? I read the linked post and was sure, by the end, that it was POE. "This satire's not bad," I said to myself.
    And then I read the rest of your post, went back and checked Right Stuff's blogroll, and realized it was serious. I stand amazed.

  4. Hm. I may owe BlackAndGoldFan a partial apology. I went back and read through the comments on the first thread there (the one about the sign), and apparently she does actually understand that the First Amendment cuts both ways. (I'm looking at the 09 December 20:17 comment.)

    Her error, then, is not in misunderstanding the constitution. Instead, it is her reflexive and unsupported assumption that anyone who disagrees with the sentiment on the sign must be trying to take away her (and/or the sign owner's) First Amendment right. Just to be clear, nobody is trying to say that BlackAndGoldFan or Bill Balsamico ought not to be allowed to say "screw atheists". All the "trolls"* on that thread were simply saying that "screw atheists" is a bigoted thing to say.

    BlackAndGoldFan is apparently unable to tell the difference.

    * I use the term "troll" to identify someone who is posting (or speaking) entirely for the purpose of starting an argument and making people upset; that definition explicitly does not include people who feel they have a legitimate point to make, and are trying to make it. BlackAndGoldFan appears to be using the term to indicate "someone who disagrees with me on my blog". This strikes me as either ignorant or disengenuous.

  5. "They're young, 20-something Generation-Me members who have been raised in the religion of political correctness and that the only thing that matters is how they feel."

    Ahh get that stereotyping brush out and paint all your enemies with it as to demonize them and make them not human. How patronizing, wrong (in sentiment and in the facts) and very droll. Can someone say ad hom?

  6. @Beamstalk: "Can someone say ad hom?"

    I was going to say "bigotry", actually.

  7. Eh. Personally, I’m just pleased to see you’re pissing this blackngoldfan douche off so badly. It’s always fun(ny) when an idiot who knows nothing of atheists, atheism, and even their own traditions (re: blackngoldfan is apparently oblivious as to the origins of Christmas decorations and so on) get worked up enough to launch a silly little screed. And then, of course, have you, PF, tear it apart and laugh maniacally as the blood mixed with splintered bones and annihilated ego flows down the drain. (Well, that’s my mental envisioning of it, anyway.)

    It’s also amusing to see blackngoldfan claim that you’re apparently too “politically correct” to comment on her blog. I don’t even know what the hell that could possibly mean; maybe she thinks you speak of sunshine and daisies and fluffy bunny-rabbits and pink star-dappled unicorns or something. Whereas you have a far filthier tongue than I do, and I consider myself rather … unwashed at times.

    Oh what fun it is to ride on the shreds of an idiot’s rant …

  8. I don't get how these Christian hypocrites dare usurp the pagan custom of the tree. Apparently they don't give a shit what their silly little deity has to say about it.

    Jeremiah 10:2 KJV Thus saith the LORD, Learn not the way of the heathen, and be not dismayed at the signs of heaven; for the heathen are dismayed at them. 3* For the customs of the people are vain: for one cutteth a tree out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman, with the axe. 4* They deck it with silver and with gold; they fasten it with nails and with hammers, that it move not. 5 They are upright as the palm tree, but speak not: they must needs be borne, because they cannot go. Be not afraid of them; for they cannot do evil, neither also is it in them to do good.


  9. Cross posted to Black and Gold Fan's blog:

    To Black and Gold Fan.

    Whether or not this post is censored will tell me a lot about your character. Please give me this chance to defend myself, my character, and my opinions. I do not hide behind anonymity, I did not accuse you of hatred, and I most certainly do not troll.


    "Troll Number 4" here. You know, the one who hides behind his anonymity.

    First of all. My name is James Schumacher. I often go by the internet moniker of "Quasar." I am an active member of the SMRT skeptic forums, and often do the rounds between blogs I find interesting. "Troll # 1's" blog is one of them. I live in Brisbane, Australia. And I have a blog, but I haven't updated it in about a year. It's here:

    Like I said, I haven't updated it in ages, though. I have two Google accounts, one for g-mail, one for blogger. This one is for g-mail, so I never bothered giving it a profile.

    My reason for being here, and I want to stress this, is not to troll. I loathe people who use the internet for such stupidity. I visit the blogs of people I disagree with to get a handle on their opinions. Sometimes, my emotions get the better of me, and I respond. In this case, the fact that you were misrepresenting a friend of mine (and still are), irritated me. Normally, though, I just read.

    Secondly, I did not accuse you of being haters. I accused the person who would put a sign saying "Screw the [Minority group]" of being a bigot. You are not he, and "bigot" and "hater" are not the same thing.

    Had Mr Balsamico put up a saign saying "Praise Jesus, for the life He has given us, for His mercy and His grace, for He is the Lord. Also, Merry Christmas," I doubt anyone would have had a problem with that: it's his sign, he can do what he wants with it. But there is a far cry between that and "Screw the atheists!" How would you take it if said sign replaced "atheist" with "christian"?

    Finally, I find it slightly ironic that someone who censored two of my comments in the thread prior to this, both of which were more important to me than the one you singled out, would accuse me of hiding behind anything.

    And one last point: I find it odd that you are still claiming that "Troll # 1" actually made a racial slur. She didn't. Either you are incapable of detecting sarcasm, or are simply willing to misrepresent others opinions to demonise them. I really do hope it is the former.

  10. "Screw the Christians"... I feel better now :)

  11. And they censored and responded. Didn't mischaracterise my post all that much though.

    I thanked them for the response, told them I acccepted their right to reject my post, told them I also agree with and would defend Free Speech (mentioning that FS cut's both ways, giving us the right to respond to Balsamico with "Congrats: you're a bigot"), and told them I would take my leave before wishing them a Merry Christmas.

    If there's something I really don't like, it's being accused of trolling. I. DO. NOT. TROLL.

  12. Troll #2 here. My reply...

    1. The post on my site had absolutely nothing to do with atheists having a hard time getting into Christian colleges. I agree with you. Why would an atheist want to go to a Christian college? Did you actually read the post, or did you just want to misrepresent me? My post did touch on about how people going to a non-regionally accredited Christian college have a lot of difficulty getting professional certifications, transferring colleges, or going to secular grad school.

    2. Atheist <> Liberal

    3. You shouldn't pretend to have an argument with us but censor many of our replies (speaking for the other commenters here). It's bad manners.

    4. I'm not trolling. I'm defending a friend from misrepresentation.

    That's all. Continue on playing with your imaginary friend.

  13. Oh dear. Her latest post, an article from World Nut Daily, compares christian "persecution" to negro persecution. Sarcasticquote's entirely applicable.

    This is the same person who said this:

    "How anyone can equate someone practicing a godless religion by choice with the God-given color of one's skin still has my brain hurting." Blackandgoldfan

  14. Troll #3 here. He apparently completely ignored my very explicit point that the issue was the blogger finding the sign funny where he would clearly not find it funny for other groups. He also claims to have responded to me but I don't see it in that thread (nor for that matter was my comment published).

    I'd reply there pointing this out but it is quite clear that Blackandgold has neither a desire nor ability to listen to people who disagree with him. Since he's stated explicitly our comments won't be published I see no point in continuing to bother this dialogue.

  15. Considering that fundamentalist Christianity is directly or indirectly responsible for the vast majority of injustices suffered by Jews and blacks from the Middle Ages right through to the present, it's no wonder they get a bit touchy when the subject is raised. If you listen to wingnut revisionist accounts, fundies spent history defending the Jews (from all those other people who believed they deserved punishment for killing Jesus) and blacks (from all those other people who believed them to be tainted by the curse of Ham) and never even participated in let alone promoted any kind of persecution.

  16. First off, let me say that I found your site via Black and Goldfan. In the past, I have aired my opposing viewpoints on Blackandgoldfan's blog and she (yes, she's a female) has respectfully disagreed. The exchanges that she had with some of you is very disappointing. I too can't stand it when members of the right use the term "trolls" to refer to commenters who dare disagree with them. One of the best parts about blogging is the chance to have respectful and intelligent debates. On both of my blogs, I welcome opposing viewpoints that are respectful. Even if I don't change my mind, hearing another's viewpoint at least causes me to look at a topic from a different perspective. In fact, for my blog about race relations (Diversity Ink), I have invited people who disagree with me to either comment or write a guest post. When I read an earlier post by Blackandgoldfan about the so-called war on Christmas, I invited her to write a post on Diversity Ink about why she feels this way. My comments never made it to her blog and she never responded to my request. Although it may be futile, I am going to extend the offer one last time.

    It's sad that many of the right-wing blogs I read feel the need to demonize those who disagree with them by labeling them "trolls". It seems they would be happy if the only comments they ever received were by people in lockstep with their views. To me, that makes for a rather dull and one-sided blog.


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