Friday, January 2, 2009

Me, I'm Not

(50 points to the first person who can tell me where the title of this post is from.)

I think I have come to a conclusion as to why fundamentalists twist themselves into knots trying to convice themselves that atheists actually do believe in god, we just don't want to admit it. (For the record, I am an actual, true atheist. I do not believe, even a little, in any deity. I have not a shred of belief. I also don't give a flying fuck what you or anyone else believes. Have at it! I don't care.)

I think the fundamentalists' faith is weak. It is brittle and easily snapped. What they believe has no relation to what the bible actually says. It has no basis in anything at all. And it keeps them locked up in a tiny, little box of hatred and rules. It must be very hard to believe that which makes you miserable. It must also be very hard to be confronted by people who don't believe and yet are happy and moral and fulfilled.

So, the fundamentalists say to each other, there are no atheists. They believe in god, they just don't want to admit it. And they're all going to hell when they die. So there!

However, when talking to an atheist, do they really and truly believe that there is no God at all in the entirety of the universe or in life? yes, if you're actually talking to an atheist. that's it. no god, nowhere. On the surface, most Atheists do say that they think that there is no God; that God doesn’t exist; that Jesus Christ was merely a man (maybe they’ll say good; maybe not yeesh). Very likely the why is this being capitalized? Atheist in question will point to some particular instance where they, at one time, may have believed in God, may have prayed to Him, yet, their prayer wasn’t answered in the way that was desired or desirable. Never heard that one from an atheist before. I've heard atheists say that prayer doesn't work, but this is an odd interpretation of that. They may point to a tragedy, such as the December 26th, 2004 Sumatran Earthquake and Indian Ocean Tsunami in which hundreds of thousands were killed. Again, this isn't what made someone an atheist, this is a question to the religious: why does a loving god allow suffering to happen? I think it's quite the valid question, but I guess not. Perhaps they will point one to the September 11th 2001 terrorist attacks. Perhaps the Atheist in question will call back to a time when a loved one passed away, despite the prayers of him/herself and/or of others. see above Maybe the Atheist in question will talk about a home and a family where one or both parents were abusive, were abused, and despite calling out to God to help, the prayer was not answered in the way that was deemed beneficial. he makes it sound like atheism is some sort of extended job review. "well, god just wasn't we really needed in this position. i think his resume was a little misleading" In just about every case, Atheists likely deemed God as non-existent thanks to a past experience in which God didn’t reveal himself in the desired fashion. or at all. ever. Further, Atheists also often disbelieve in God out of rebellion to Godly parents. ah, the "rebellion" meme. atheists are like obnoxious teenagers who claim disbelief because they don't like being told what to do. sigh. This writer knows several such Atheists here in Japan who became such because they were “tired of having the Bible shoved down” their “throats” or in their “face”. because if you know one atheist, you know them all. really, this should have been an object lesson to the writer as to the results of being an Asshole For Christ, but whatever.

Whatever the case, most people who choose to become Atheists do so as a result of a reaction to some unsavory experience in which God either did not do what the Atheist wanted, or because someone who claimed Christ did something horrible to them. no. that's not it. i became an atheist when i actually sat down and read the bible, cover to cover. you can't read that book, every word, and not come to the conclusion that you've been worshipping an alien sadist with anger control issues. seriously, read the old testament. as for the new testament, jesus was wandering about the desert engaging in nonviolent acts of anarchy and spouting your basic hippy creed. which your average christian immediately reinterprets to "hate everyone who isn't you". not exactly inspiring. However, do Atheists believe that God doesn’t exist totally and 100%, or do they merely believe that God doesn’t exist in their lives? if they are atheists, they do not believe in god at all. if they do believe that god exists, but isn't relevant or active in their lives, then they are agnostics, which is an entirely different discussion.

Now we get the least rational argument against atheism ever. (Hint: atheists are a rational, logical people. Attempting to convert them with illogical, irrational arguments WON'T WORK.)

The Elephant Joke and Atheistic Beliefs
Probably everyone has heard this rendering of the Elephant Joke, though in a different version. The Joke goes this way:

A. Why do Elephants paint their toenails red?
B. I don’t know, why?
A. So they can hide in strawberry patches!
B. That’s not true!
A. Have you ever seen an Elephant in a strawberry patch?
B. Well, no!
A. Then it must work!

My favorite version of this comes from the Simpsons. One bear siting in Springfield incites millions of dollars in spending on fighter jets to keep away bears. Lisa comments on the waste, and Homer points out that it's working: nobody has seen a bear in Springfield since the jets started patrolling. Lisa picks up a rock and says that the rock keeps tigers away, proven by the fact that no one in Springfield has seen a tiger since she picked up the rock. Homer then offers to buy the rock.

The question may arise, “What does this joke have to do with the beliefs of Atheists?”
nothing. Change a few words only the most important ones, and basically we have what Atheists believe.

A. God doesn’t exist.
B. How do you know?
A. I’ve never seen God.
B. That doesn’t mean he doesn’t exist!
A. Have you ever seen God?
B. Well, no!
A. Then he must not exist!!!
yeah, pretty much, but that's entirely different from the elephant joke. for obvious reasons i will not bother to type out. (if you really need me to explain why the elephant joke is different from the preceding paragraph, just get the lobotomy and stop bothering the rest of us.)

This, truly, is the kernel of what Atheists believe.
I don't believe in things that can't be proven to exist! my reliance on logic and rational thinking is ludicrous. In one way or another, there came a point in Atheists’ lives, and because they did not “see” God, they dismissed him as not ever having existed. well, yeah. But again, is this only in the Atheists’ lives, or over the entire world? i have no idea everything that happens in the entire world, and neither does this asshat. nobody does. i cannot speak to everything that happens, or has ever happened. neither do i assert that if someone came to me with incontrovertible evidence of god, i wouldn't believe. shoving a bible in my face, however, is not incontrovertible evidence. Insulting my intelligence won't work either. Though many Atheists will claim loudly and proudly that they believe God does not exist, I am atheist, here me roar! when diving deeper into discussion with Atheists, their true beliefs, with unanimity, come shining through their outward words. as opposed to inward words?

Atheists Are Really Agnostics no, agnostics are agnostics

This is a quote spoken by an evangelist this writer heard during his college days. So, you're taking the word of an evangelist minister, a christian, over the word of atheists as to what atheists are? why don't we ask rich white guys what life is like for poor black women? oh, wait . . . that's the GOP gameplan. hmmm. The Evangelist in question went on to explain his meaning, and much of what he said is reflected in this point below. In reality, Atheists tend more to be Agnostics than to truly be an Atheist. some people who are really agnostics may call themselves atheists, but what does this have to do with atheists? i could call myself a man, but that doesn't mean you should take my word on what an erection feels like. What is an Agnostic? Webster’s defines an Agnostic in the following way:

a person who holds the view that any ultimate reality (as God) is unknown and probably unknowable; broadly: one who is not committed to believing in either the existence or the nonexistence of God or a god ( just a stylistic bitch, but i hate this kind of linking. my free blog allows me more style than that.

Agnostics further believe that God exists, but either (a.) not in their lives, (b.) in the world as a whole, or (c.) both (a.) and (b.) God exists, but to Agnostics, he does not interact with the world, does not bother himself with its problems, and basically, after creating the world, left it and its inhabitants to themselves.
interestingly, i know a lot of professed christians and jews who come a lot closer to this belief system than true christianity or judaism. should i conclude that all christians and jews are really agnostics? Most Atheists, when diving into deeper discussion with them about their beliefs, reveal this belief as the kernel and core of their beliefs with unanimity. again, assuming i can even believe this asshat, that only represents the professed atheists he has spoken to. this does not necessarily represent all atheists. (i would rather set my gums on fire than talk to this guy.) Does God exist? Maybe he does for you, but he doesn’t in the Atheist’s life. you know, i fail to see how that statement is inconsistent with atheism. for instance, my SIL has been diagnosed with an incurable illness that will greatly shorten her lifespan. recently, she has found much comfort in religion. I do not begrudge her her belief or the comfort it brings her. For her, god does exist, and it makes her life easier for her to bear. does this mean i believe in god? no, i believe in her belief. Does God interact in the world today? He doesn’t in the Atheist’s life (at least, this is the claim). In reality, Atheists are really Agnostics. no we're not. agnostics are agnostics.

Freedom From Religion?
What has been entirely compelling, not to mention quite humorous, is to watch Atheists and their actions in the current Culture War.
you know, atheists are not one monolithic bloc, anymore than christians are. i am sure Mr. Lovelace would be appalled to be put in the same group as say, catholics, yet he groups all atheists together as one. i am not involved in a culture war, i hate richard dawkins, but i do share one thing with all atheists: get your fucking religion out of my tax dollars. seriously. why should i pay for religous-based abstinence training in public schools, or religious displays on public land? Most recently, in the States of Washington and Wisconsin on both States’ Capitol Grounds respectively, the Freedom From Religion Foundation ( erected a sign prior to Christmas, which states the following:

At this season of the Winter Solstice may reason prevail.
There are no gods, no devils, no angels, no heaven or hell.
There is only our natural world.
Religion is but myth and superstition that hardens hearts and enslaves minds.
i think this last bit is very true, but it's a little rude to put it out there like that.

The interesting thing here is that Winter Solstice – while being claimed in the signs erected by FFRF as atheistic in nature
the winter solstice occurs at the instant when the sun's position in the sky is at its greatest angular distance on the other side of the equatorial plane from the observer's hemisphere (the shortest day of the year). in other words, it is an astronomical event, devoid of religion or belief. is actually a date which his observed by 34 cultures as a religious day. sure, it's still an astonomical event, devoid of religon or belief. In fact, the first known observances of Winter Solstice happened in the time of the Celts in Europe, later being adopted as a religious holiday by the Romans. It was further viewed religiously by the early Guatemalan Natives as early as 1800 BC. It is interesting, and yet, quite ironic, that a group claiming that God doesn’t exist would use terminology deemed religious in nature by several religions. IT'S AN ASTRONOMICAL EVENT. also, most Jews I know refer to December 25th as "christmas". are they secretly christian? Could this slip of print on a sign designed to propagate Atheism is actually telling the world that Atheists are, in fact, Agnostics?

Evolution and Atheism – Like a Hand in a Glove
The reason why Darwin’s Idea of Evolution is so appealing to Atheists and Atheism is precisely because it makes no mention, no allusion, nor gives any credit to God.
it's also freakin' science! Much similarly to Atheism, Evolution bases itself on nothing. except science! Yes, it is called a Scientific Theory, and a myriad of scientists attest to books and volumes of data, “experimentation”, findings, research, and other so-called scientific documentation to “prove” Evolution as some sort of fact, but in reality, Evolution is a religion. no, it's not, it's science! i can refuse to believe in gravity all i want, if i jump off of a building, i will not float. All the data, experimentation, findings, research, and documentation is basically faith and hope based upon more faith and hope in the idea that a man’s faith and hope (that of Charles Darwin) is correct. no, it's science. SCIENCE! As God is totally excluded from Evolution, science does not exclude god as a religious basis, it excludes god because it is entirely useless to have "god did it" as a possible answer to every experiment. anybody could be a scientist if that were an option. hell, my dog could be a scientist. (well, his reasoning would be that I did it, in the same manner that I magically open doors and provide food, but same theory.) it, in a sense, is Atheism repackaged with “scientific” wording and terminology. atheism is not science. this asshat just has no idea what science is. none at all. controlled experiments, reproducable results, using facts as the basis for theories, is just completely foreign to him. it's so foreign in fact, that the only possible way for him to understand it is as religion. This furthers my theory that religion renders one incapable of rational thought. This is why the vast majority of self-professing atheists give full support to Evolution at every turn, using it as much as a crutch as Atheists claim Christians use the Bible. other than science, what else would an atheist give full support to? creationism? no. "intelligent design"? not so much. yeesh. Atheism and Evolution go together like a hand in a glove and are, in fact, two hands of the same belief system of Atheistic Agnosticism. there is no such thing as atheistic agnosticism, and fuck you very much for making me type that.

What Atheism REALLY Is it's not agnosticism.

We need to understand that Atheism is a religion in and of itself. no, atheism is not a religion. in fact, atheism is the exact opposite of religion. it's notreligion. Though Atheists may disagree, their beliefs are just one more lane in the Wide Gate and Broad Way that leads to Destruction (Matthew 7.13). In essence, Atheism is really Satanism in disguise. here we are. first i'm agnostic, now i'm a satanist. lovely. look, i don't believe in satan any more than i believe in god (i really don't think man needs the help when it comes to evil), therefore i don't worship satan. you can't worship what you don't believe in. Anything that the Devil can use to lead people away from Jesus Christ and from Eternal Salvation, he will (and does) use. Atheism, in its rabid RRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!!! opposition to Christianity yet eerie silence towards Islam i don't go off on islam because i don't live in a country where islam is being shoved in my face every day. i'm not secretly pro-shariah., New Age, and other world religions, is showing its true colors that it is nothing more than Satanism in better looking terminology. first of all, Mr. Lovelace probably means "better sounding" not better looking, second of all, I know a Satanist who would be pretty pissed to be lumped together with atheists and new agers. (he's a really nice guy who hardly ever sacrifices kittens and babies.) The Bible makes it clear that anything that denies Jesus Christ his rightful place as God is of the devil. This, sadly enough, includes Atheism. that's it, use the book i find no more relevant than any other to condemn me. in the spirit of converting me. good luck with that.

Conclusion – Is The Joke On You?
we'll see.

Atheist and Agnostic Friends, you just called me a fucking devil worshipper, now i'm your friend? bite me! and anyone else who may happen to read this lesson, may I ask a question? Is the Joke on you? In reality, Atheism, Agnosticism, New Age, and any other belief and religion that deny Jesus Christ, which seek to eradicate the Bible as it is known i don't seek to eradicate the bible. read it all you want. i read it all the time., and deny or modify the existence of God is a shill of the Devil, designed to lead people astray. i always was a bad influence. Even many so-called Christian Churches, such as Roman Catholicism see, told you he wouldn't want to be lumped in with the catholics, Mormonism, Jehovah’s Witness/Watchtower Society, and the Unity Church all modify Jesus Christ's form or maybe that was supposed to be from? i dunno. Who He Really Is. what is up with the random capitalization? The sad fact is the devil uses Atheism and Atheistic belief to draw people astray, and lead them away from the Truth that can save. and mormonism, and catholicism, and jehovah's witnesses. i think it would be quicker for Mr. Lovelace to list whom he doesn't think are satanists. If you are an Atheist, an Agnostic, or are having doubts about God’s “existence”, then I challenge you to seek for God, for his word declares that anyone who seeks him in truth will find him. the bible is the inerrant word of god, and we know it is because the bible says so. round and round we go. If you knock on God’s Door, he will open it. if you knock on my door, i'll answer it, and i've got cookies! If you ask for God you will receive him. Seek God and he will be found: that is a promise straight from his inerrant, written Word (see Matthew 6.33; 7.8-27; Jeremiah 29.11-13).

A Note to Christian Brethren priceless

Brethren, this is remove this "is" to make sense of this sentence final word is to you, today. When encountering an Atheist, remember that he or she is not the one you are struggling against (Ephesians 6.12). we're just atheists. or maybe mormons. Remember to keep the debate and argument out of the personal realm, no matter how viciously you may be attacked or how greatly your values, beliefs, and ideas are challenged (and this will likely happen when debating and discussing Jesus Christ and the Bible with Atheists). we're like rabid animals. when was the last time an atheist came to your door to hand out atheistic literature and convert you to atheism? never? evangelicals get all kinds of bent out of shape when the person they're relentlessly attacking, rrr, attempting to convert, fights back. if you don't get down on your knees as soon as they say "Jesus", you're attacking them. Remember that turning the other cheek, as spoken of in Matthew 5, isn’t just the physical punch, but the verbal one as well. At the end of the day, it is not you who will be convincing Atheists, or any other unbeliever, of the truth of Jesus Christ, it will be Jesus Christ Himself. Keep it real hahahaha, but keep it in the debating arena. If an Atheist pushes buttons (and likely they will) the big red button!, find a way to blow off steam that is beneficial for the both of you (this writer has found bicycling, weight lifting, and boxing training to be quite effective) so, like, right in the middle of an argument with an atheist, he just starts bicycling, lifting weights or boxing? now i know why he thinks all atheists are evil- every atheist he has ever met is still laughing at him., and last, but certainly not least, pray: pray for yourself to have the Spirit of the LORD with you when you talk to an Atheist. feel free. i don't care if you pray Yes, Jesus had some hard things to say to the Pharisees, Sadducees, and other Atheists of his day, they weren't atheists. pharisees were jews, and so were the sadducees. what is this asshat talking about? but he always spoke the truth in love. Pray that your words, while having the cleansing salt of the Truth of Jesus Christ, will be bound in love. An Atheist who talks to you about God is seeking God, or seeking to make you shut the fuck up. and you may be the only Bible he is able to read before making a decision for Christ. what? is this the "you could get hit by a bus at any moment argument"? Pray for yourself. Finally, pray for the Atheist. If one truly carries out his or her life as Jesus Christ did (and he said he would always be with us, and give us words through his Spirit), it will make a huge impact on the Atheist. Pray for him or her, and fast as the Holy Ghost leads you. so, pray, bicycle, lift weights, box and starve yourself. sounds like a plan


  1. cookie tease!
    (you see, i have invented this new game for myself, that everytime you equate "being saved" to "getting cookies", i will call you a cookie tease. unless this bothers you, in which case i will stop. it just find it endlessly amusing - your offer of cookies, made to a person you don't know and will probably never meet who lives far away from you and will cost in time, materials and postage, is MORE HONEST than, say, this asshat's arguments and "offering to help someone be save by JC")

    also. i have known atheists who call atheism their religion. and those i have asked couldn't explain why they called it that. i think this is a societal meme - on forms that ask what religion someone is, there isn't a box that says "i do not have a religion" but there is a box that says "Atheist". so, even though atheism is inherently the LACK of religion, most people are stupid and think that atheism is religion (it is a religious claim or position, i think, claiming to not have religion, but is not a religion. as you stated. many times). i think its all very very stupid, and i DO NOT understand why people feel they have the right to ask random strangers what their religion is.
    of course, i ALWAYS answer because the reaction to "ban-draoi" amuses the hell outta me. but i'm snarky that way.

    also also - Satanist? satanism, which is a religion that is NOT devil-worship, is NOT atheism. i am saying what you said. but this pisses me off. i think i am also going to write about this, on my LJ, and link to you.

  2. cookie tease! i love it.

    ban-draoi? i check the box that says other, then write in "none", precisely because atheism is not a religion. i am also fond of asking people who ask me about my religion what their favorite sexual position is. to me, it's that personal. if i want to talk about it, fine, but it's not a stranger's conversation to start.

    you know, my niece became very upset yesterday because somebody on tv said "vampire" while she was eating a banana, and she was convinced that would turn her into a vampire. (don't ask, i didn't get it either.) this struck me as about as sensible as the belief system of christian fundamentalists.

    my best friend is a satanist. it is not devil-worship, it certainly isn't atheism, and he's the nicest person i know. a great father, too. his ex very nearly succeeding in keeping his children away from him by telling the court that he was a satanist. fortunately, he reads the bible as much as i do, and was able to fake being christian. he shouldn't have had to.

  3. ban-draoi literally means "woman druid" - i say it to confuse people who annoy me, by asking me what my religion is FOR NO REASON. otherwise i just write "pagan" :)
    i am sorry about your niece thinking bananas transmit vampirism. did she recently read the book about the vampire bunny that sucks the juice out of veggies? i got nuthin.
    years and years ago, when i was living in Alabama, i had a friend who had an abuse husband who was in the Air Force and had gotten in trouble with his First Shirt AND Base Brass for drug use. they got divorced. he got custody of the kid because she was a High Priestess (but he was the Priest! but he claimed church attendence, etc). she got totally screwed, and the kid got even more screwed... your friend was very lucky. i am glad he won, and got to raise his children. it really pisses me off that minority religions are effectivly cut out from first amendment rights.

  4. bunicula! I loved that book! oh, thank you for that delightful memory. though i certainly shouldn't show it to my niece.

    i have no idea how the banana was involved. i felt like telling her that legends of vampirism are partly based on people like you and i who have porphyria, but i couldn't stand it if she was scared of me after that.

    i'm sorry about your friend. i'm more sorry for her children. i can hope for them, but i can't pray.

    my satanist buddy and i had to attend church for 3 months so we could have a priest write a glowing review of how good a christian he was. (well, he had to attend, I was moral support.) those children have no idea the sacrifice i made for them!

    there are no first amendment rights. there is no separation of church and state. effectively, we do live in a christian country. the sick part is, the christians don't think it's christian enough!


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